Gearslutz gain staging. Using studio to record podcast style content.

Gearslutz gain staging YouTube This is a completely different issue to gain staging within the DAW, which is about keeping operation straightforward whilst keeping in the required range of disparate plug-ins, in which case dropping levels to about -18dBr peak before inserts, I think, would be pretty sensible and should work OK in most cases. Also - you can set colors to 'break' at any point on the meter according to your liking, for example at or around -18dBFS. With proper gain staging, every device in a chain receives an optimal input level and sends an In order to understand gain structuring in all its depth, one should have the necessary knowledge of the elements that deals with gain, audio levels, and differences and Simply put, Gain staging happens at every path that can alter the gain in audio or MIDI. The No. 1 Website for Pro Audio There are many guides on YT, just search for "daw gain staging". I don't get exactly how to do it in a reliable way gain-staging in the unit. I then turn on my powered speakers and adjust the volume on the speaker to a comfortable level I'm sure the topic of Gain Staging has been covered, but I figured I'd ask anyway. And IDK why but for the sake of gain staging I had to reduce the bassline so much that it seemed to quite. It may not be clipping anymore, but it's taking the peak level on the mix buss up into the yellow, so I instantly feel like I have to fight my drum levels as I continue Having read several threads on the matter, I'm in some doubt about gain staging at the end of the chain when spreading the load over consecutive limiters. Even if it has been covered, time and experienc. 31st October 2022 #1. Reflex Acoustics releases the Fourier Compressor with auto gain-staging across 100 bands The Fourier Compressor from Reflex Acoustics is a digital audio effect plugin that uses the Fast Fourier Transform to implement a 100-band mid/side compressor where every frequency band continuously adjusts its threshold and make-up gain in order to imprint a consistent From Gearslutz. I'm Hi I am want to know how to have a proper calibration or gain staging between Plug ins Inserts and Analog Inserts. In VCC 1, this was the most common compmaint that it was difficult to A/B and gain match. e. Every time I fix something, something else goes backwards. Do you have to look at the PEAK Even when I take my tracks out of unity gain position and start mixing them to proper levels, I still find that the peaks in my drum tracks are REALLY knocking up the peak volume level on the mix buss. In short, you mix to a certain level (i. Static gain as mentioned in the K-System or others isn't useful to me right now. Regarding the gain knob and the output +4 meter on the I was reading the thread RE: 32 vs. 25th February 2021 | Show parent #9. 21st July 2014 #2. What I don't know is: 1. Depending on the design of your equipment this might or Sorry if this isnt quite the right forum, but I assume its the one with the most experience with this sort of thing! The studio i'm in has an old studi I took some of the initial advice from the gearslutz posting, adapted some as I'm dealing with Samplitude in 32-bit float, and not Pro-tools or dealing with any other fixed 24-bit limitations, and have found renewed headroom very refreshing. I Hi all, I've been trying to understand gain staging and I wanted to ask if these steps seem right to you ? 1. Here for the gear Joined: Oct 2022. It's so simple Hmmm, welll this thread is quite obviously going to run from now to eternity, since there will never be agreement reached between all parties --- that' Answers; 1. 7th April 2012 #2. I see two things here: 1. 17th But honestly, I would forget about all this until you have run the units at a nominal level and played around with your gain staging. the purpose of the unit is to eat dBs but 18dB just like that is a lot. Hey friends, I came here to ask a question regarding the gain staging that jaycen joshua does and if there is anyone who can explain this technique/process to me better or if any of you use it Basically in several 'mix with the masters' videos a Gain staging for DAW based production? Any good online resources? Gain staging with multiple compression. I'm sure the topic of Gain Staging has been covered, but I figured I'd ask anyway. Pedantic Sound. Hey guys, Here's a simple scenario. Supported by Hello, I'm trying to conceptualize the concept of 'gain staging' through plugins. loji. Also, is it me or were there some changes to I have a few questions about gain staging since this is an analog mixer. La façon dont vous acheminez vos signaux et mettez en place vos projets est importante, car chaque couche s'appuie sur les fondations que vous avez posées auparavant. I still I know proper gain staging is essential in both recording and live work, but I'm wondering is the principle the same in both cases? From what I've learned for recording, first you set the faders on all your mixer channels in your DAW (including the master fader) to unity point, switch off all plugins, then you bring up the pre gain to set the input level on each channel so Hello all, Is it -12 or -18 healthy for gain staging? If you boost it to 0dbfs after all the proper gain staging are you introducing bits of distortion? Are you supposed to use another plugin like ableton's compressor's gain boost or a limiter to bring the whole thing back up to 0 or something, or is the meter arrow doing the same thing? 3. To use LU Meter MK2 this way there are three things: 1) Quels sont les avantages du Gain Staging ? La production musicale est un processus. In music production and mixing, gain staging ensures that each part of the signal Mostly, but not exclusively, plugins that emulate analog should be gain staged. Reply reply brozium • To add to this, you can get to Hi there, i just have learned from a post, that you should always leave the output level of a preamp at max and tweak the input gain appropriately. 28th May 2014 #3. Basically the consensus is that working within a DAW gives you enough A famous gear (and now plugin) designer once said in a Gearslutz thread that the single biggest impact you can have on your mixing is to conform to this kind of gain staging Use subtractive eq first and boosts second so you don't drive your bus higher. 0VU/-18dBFS), and then—once the mix is done—push into a limiter for final loudness. I send a kick drum through Having read several threads on the matter, I'm in some doubt about gain staging at the end of the chain when spreading the load over consecutive limiters. Do you set the the first limiter's ceiling value In VCC 1, this was the most common compmaint that it was difficult to A/B and gain match. Hello, fellow slutz! I'm sure the topic of Gain Staging has been covered, but I figured I'd ask not registered yet? join now! login: join with Gain Staging into Consoles. Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2007 . This will help us to get a better, more "analog" mix. Usually I have my channels just below 0db or -2db at all times before I start mixing. Of course this is assuming the plugins actually represent the old gear’s performance. Structure, also has a master setting to allow enough headroom on the Master Out for any mastering plugins to effectively work and to prevent any clipping. Thanks for replying. From what I understand, it is best to hit the DAW (or virtually 'h Gain staging RE20/SM7B through ISA 428 & RODEcaster. I saw a video by a YouTube channel called "Behin the Speakers" on Gain Staging. In it someone made a reference to gain staging. If needed, I was also slicing the audio t For proper gain staging, am I wanting peak or RMS to be at 0VU? Or, like everything, does it depend? remember that the digital equalivalnt of OVU is -18dbfs anything over that would be + 0dbVU for analog and would be above its intended sweet spot. Lives for gear Joined: Jun 2008. Analog Gear mostly operates and +4dB Now what is the optimal input level range for Plug ins ? If I have a plug in that the In/out signal is -8dbfs that is +12dBU, that signal can be a bit to hot for an analog HW input. KVR Marketplace What's New? Search Developers / Brands Product Reviews Product Rankings Product Ratings Groups: Whats's in? Patches & I made a safe copy of one of my projects, cleared all eqs and inserts and started gain staging. If I'm calibrating my analog chain to +4dBU, that means I'm calibrating my converters to a tone at -18dBFS, correct? Does this mean that the best level Long-time lurker, first-time poster here. Hey Guys and Girls, I'm having a few technical headaches with my gain-staging strategy and wondered if some of you knowledgeable folks out there could help me out and give some advice. im wondering about where should I blend the vocals is it a dB thing or more of EQ if the track i topping out at 0dB where should the vocals be volume wise. Using Pro Tools LE - if I'm not peaking on a kick track at -6 using post-fader monitoring, but I am peaking using pre-fader monitoring, does that mean I have a gain stage problem? Thanks in advance. I then turn on my powered speakers and adjust the volume on the speaker to a comfortable level I understand that their vintage EQ does model analogue, so gain staging is important for those plugins. So feeding your interf The No. I lowered some levels, but found if I was cranking it up, I was still hearing the The gain knob is sometimes labeled “make up gain” because you use it to make up for level lost through compression. My problem with "not worrying much about input level" and gain staging is that when I check the output peak level, I find it difficult with Thrust to actually get louder while keeping the peaks under control. It's always best Hi all, I'm not understanding gain staging and metering -18dBFS very well. Used this way, the compressor gain may raise the noise floor (as raising gain in any device may do). I know use your ears (been doing that for a few decades Neve Portico II > Hairball 1176 > Warm La2a Thinking about Signal to Noise ratio more than Tone. Gear Head Joined: Mar 2015. The noise comes from the line amplifier in the master section. I will keep plugging away at this and at some point take a decision to include it or not Hi all, I'm not understanding gain staging and metering -18dBFS very well. +4dBu = 1. Registered User Joined: Mar 2012. Hello, I’m a bit beyond the amateur side of mixing, as I have about 500 hours under my belt working with some other clients. Or lower the input of the mixbus limiter. com - The history of the name change. Actually Gain staging takes at the most 5-10 minutes for me. 24th September 2015 #1. And I start every track with a 150 page (!) gearslutz discussion of gain staging for daw recording -- a giant catfight with some useful ideas in it Hope this helps with what you asked. I can't tell you exactly about the internal structure in BFD and the way it works (does it really clip internally; floating point architecture; etc. A Trim In the analog world, gain staging is important to both keep gear from clipping and to maximize S/N ratio. . 228V on an RMS volt meter (some might round up to 1. 2. I have tried to make that 12dB go away but it is inherent to the scheme. If you "make beats" or Forgive me for yet another thread about gain staging in the world of digital audio I was wondering if wise and knowledgable types could tell me if there is anything fundamentally TL;DR Add a gain VST for +12dB on the master, aim for peaks near 0dBFS on master, and don't clip the master. In modern DAWs we have a massive headroom before the master output so the only two reasons I see to go for some sort of generic value for all channels is if you a) use plugins set up to have a nominal operating level, for example ones that emulate some analog Gain staging issues, Soundcraft Desk ADDA conversion. Here is what I know: - When mixing, you should keep your insert levels of vst instruments and recordings at around -18dbfs. You're simply telling your converters what voltage level to use as a reference against the dBFS scale. By lowering the line trim we now have a good level into the Not sure on articles except for a MONSTER thread over at Gearslutz, which is where I started to grasp the idea. I've browsed the forums for quite a while. Just Portico in chain, I set a mic level to peak at -12db. yes . If the average is at -18dBFS then there a whopping 18dB headroom for peaks. I have seen a couple of other posts but nothing that quite solves/confirms what my problems are. Also, is it me or were there some changes to With respect to gain staging the kits separate channels, i am initially picking up all the peaks for each channel and then reducing the gain by an amount that gets each channel to -18dbfs. But hopefully this is the right place to ask this question and hopefully gain some wisdom. " Gain staging is just adjusting gain at various stages in the signal chain, nothing sacred or mysterious. me 1. Gain Staging (structure) refers to the signal level as it What is gain staging? Gain staging is the process of making sure the audio is set to an optimal level for the next processor in the chain in order to minimize noise and distortion. I quote from the Waves website: "The problem is that you have no real way of knowing what the optimum values are unless you’re able to “see” the levels (or, more accurately, a representation of the levels) on a meter. This is a repost from another thread. 8dBu VU is a whole different story (enough topics around here about that). No. Does this mean in the individual track, or the master track? Kind regards some years ago I seem to remember a gearslutz article or. 228V, and going into your monitor controller About 5 years ago I switched to my current method, which is to set up most of the gain staging the same way (i. Noob question here I need some advice on how to properly set the gain on my aux monitor I have read this post on gearslutz but I don't get the whole story behind gain staging BEFORE I use inserts, when I can just bring the channel back to a normal level after I used my effects. You can achieve the finest sound for your recording by staging via your analog and digital devices. Last post. Using metering for gain staging is good practice. To use LU Meter MK2 this way there are three things: 1) Here the thread that I learned gain staging from: The Reason Most ITB mixes don’t Sound as good as Analog mixes (restored) I don't regret reading that long thing at all as it changed my habits. I would start by stemming everything out to the summing unit at a conservative level (maybe a maximum peak level of -12dBfs and a maximum RMS reading of -18dBfs at the mix bus). 23V). Using studio to record podcast style content. I actually find its compression and eq pretty useable on non vital instruments or backing vocals. But im really confused about workflow. A common input i’m receiving from my mixes is that they sound “too pushed” or “over compressed”. Hornet offerings are confusing , there IS a dynamic Gain Riding plugin “AutoGain/ AutoGain Pro mk2“ which I have & seems to do the job well though I’m no mix engineer , But gain-staging monitors doesn't follow the same rules. Slowly turn preamp gain up until it sounds good. In VCC1, I almost alway placed a gain plugin before VCC so I could make sure that it was just kissing the red. Gain staging refers to the practice of ensuring that the audio is set to the following processor in the chain at the correct level to minimize noise. These Although Acustica suggests using Black at the beginning of each track for initial gain staging and sweetening, I decided to see how one of the consoles would compare with AlexB’s consoles. Certainly not compared to API 512's. Problem is, it's about 9 db over the O within the DAW. I have a few questions about gain staging since this is an analog mixer. Then lower the output of the bus compressor' output to keep the headroom. Buy & sell secondhand gear in the world's largest pro audio Classifieds. clusterofcedars2 🎙️. dBu and dBv are different things. I have not found the SH Gama to have a particularly hot output. Is this t I knew something was wrong when I didn't have enough input travel to hit gain reduction in some plugins! So now, I kinda don't overthink it too much, early on I try to figure out what my loudest and quietest sounds will be (I like to layer and loop a few random drums, bass and maybe synth), and try to establish rough staging from there. Contrasted to recording the act Back to gain staging 101 (no such thing as a bad question except the one not asked). So I bought the new SSL 4000 channel strip and I'm a bit confused about the gain sta Hi This feels a bit of a newb question but just need some clarity. That's all we really do when it comes down to it; gain staging of different frequencies. Feeding the 1176 a very high level simply means your preamps are being pushed and worked above "nominal" level. g. along with this gain comes an amount of noise. Just wanted to make sure it is working properly. 6th March 2024 by Jules. So i decided to ask you guys. 1 Website for Pro Audio Unfortunately neither of the manuals specify anthing useful regarding the gain staging. wel Hi there, i just have learned from a post, that you should always leave the output level of a The Reason Most ITB mixes don’t Sound as good as Analog mixes. 22nd June 2023 | Show What VU-levels do experienced Gearslutz members recommend for drums sounds within a plugin such as Britson? thanks to those that respond! Share Reply Quote. However, if you want analog distortion: 3. Hello, I am in the process of establishing proper gain structure across my studio. Yes i know, not more stuff about gain staging but i Just watched this interesting video for those who are still a little concerned about it. It had nothing to do with gain staging. Special Guest Question and Answer Archive. And you'll lose some of the vocalist's performance. Here's my basic setup. If using plugins that model vintage gear, you’re going to want to hit those plugins at a level that you would use the actual gear. Let's assume you've committed to a maximum level of -1. Or which Gain staging issue with external preamp. Originally Posted by hereticskeptic Of course, this is just one example, but sibilance and detailed clip leveling would be my main use of automation, i So if the mic pre gives you a gain range of 15dB to 60dB (say), then the equivalent line input gain range might be -15dB to 30dB or -10dB to 35dB or whatever. first the signal flow at the front of the unit: XLR in ☞ input loader ☞ transformer module ☞ input a I've done a recording where I gain staged each track, including with plugins, to get in the correct range (somewhere between -18dbfs and -10dbfs on each track), but the master channel peak level is around -11. los marbles. I watched a couple videos about gain staging and metering, and if I'm not mistaken, a good thing to see if a track is in -18 dBFS is to use a RMS-level meter or a VU-meter. When everything was analog it was a little more obvious if you were gain staging properly because you could hear too much hiss if you were too low and you could hear distortion creeping in if you were too hot (unless you want either of those). , optimize each channel's gain and then set its fader to unity before mixing) but now I set the main out fader on the mixer to unity. Posts: 622 My Fast forward to last week. I didn't worry much about A/Bing because it always sounded better with VCC. 3. Also i try to mix without touching the faders until the very end of process. I'm applying 30dB of gain on the '73, with peaks ranging from -8 to about 0 dBFS (on very loud parts), feeding into a modded WA2A with a fast optical cell. Add Warm La2a with Peak Hello! We see you've found the Newbie subforum! If you are indeed new to recording and production, please feel free to post a thread topic here if there is something you are curio We have compiled a list of the Top 5 Gain Staging & VU Metter Plugins, both free and paid. If you record a track with -12dbfs peaks, compress and bring make up gain back to -12 again. Cheers! Share Reply Quote. I learned gain staging to be something used on analog Most pro Eng's will use proper gain staging and get the now slammed meters reading around 0VU or 1. I would like to seek advice on whether there's anything wrong in my current signal chain. ), I'm getting some noise from SM7B and RE20 which are in a vocal booth. Is paying attention to meters less important during mixing than during tracking/gain staging? In reaper, if I gain stage at -18db I notice that the met Hi guys 2 questions; Im an electronic artist, i decide to learn mixing & mastering: 1/ Is my will to learn mixing and mastering pretty quickly real The No. Downside: the ITB metering on the single It’s the plugin that encapsulate our auto-gain technology in a single package, with TheNormalizer you can automatically gain stage all of your tracks thanks to the grouping function or you can normailize your buses to the LUFS you want, also if you need to meet some maximum peak specification you can also normalize to the specific dBFS level. Use them. Signal chain: Neumann KMS105 -> Stam 1073MPA -> Audioscape Opto -> Apollo Twin. So, +4dBu is 1. ↑ top; home; New Product Alert; classifieds; reviews; deal zone; events; gear database Of course the ribbon needs more gain than any condenser out there. I generally put vcc/satson as first insert on individual tracks,or trim depending on how the track was reco I use Britson for gain-staging and have recently started using Hornet VU Meter to get the levels right because it has an autogain function(as @Fanu mentioned) that will set the right levels going into Britson Channel. Here is what I try and teach to students. com to Gearspace. I made a safe copy of one of my projects, cleared all eqs and inserts and started gain staging. Do you set the the first limiter's ceiling value Maybe I have the wrong expectations, but I thought LU meter could be an incredible help with gain staging. This will be my first post, and this topic specifically is what prompted me to finally join not registered yet? join now! login: I'm looking for some advice on gain staging with the Klanghelm VUMT which I use as the first insert of every channel in Logic Pro. (Im going use Pro Tools LE for this discussion because t I understand that most people suggest having a nominal peak level of about -12 dBFS to -18 dBFS. When I insert an effect I make sure that I can control the output to bring everything down again after eqing or Use the trim/gain as the last plugin to increase the gain on the individually tracks. Think of makeup gain for proper gain staging. Downside: the ITB metering on the single So, at the moment I'm trying to master gain staging ITB. A compressor would be a better tool to make stable dynamics. Cubase has 3 levels of gain stage. Share Reply Quote. I'll agree with everyone hear that gain staging and attention to detail when tracking is crucial. Simplistic "rules" like turning the gain up to clipping and then backing off are not enough to use your available gear to it's best advantage. You don't really have anything to gain by limiting your vocals to a level of -15 dB. Is this t My problem with "not worrying much about input level" and gain staging is that when I check the output peak level, I find it difficult with Thrust to actually get louder while keeping the peaks under control. But you are on the safe side, working the way you do. For years, when I am printing a mix for mastering, I would always use the master fader to gain stage my mix so it peaks around -6 Long story short short; the majority of my client record over 2 track waves or mp3's and I'm not getting a good enough mix with the vocals and the instrumental my vocals always seem louder than the instrumentals. Ok - I know there are many different opinions about optimal gain staging levels, BUT, I am actually more curious about the following: Should I be making my 'pre-gain' adjustments based on the peak or rms values of a track!? All opinions & suggestions welcome - though I would be grateful if this does not turn into a 'battle' of who is right - I am just trying to With respect to gain staging the kits separate channels, i am initially picking up all the peaks for each channel and then reducing the gain by an amount that gets each channel to -18dbfs. With an analog mixer my understanding is that you should keep the master fader at 0 since if you are clipping at unity it means you are clipping the mix bus and reducing the fader wont reduce the clipping, it will just reduce the level of the clipped signal. Posts: 1,268 My Recordings/Credits My Studio. Contrasted to recording the act I've been seeing the term gain staging pop up a lot lately and I wanted to get some expert opinions on gain staging in a DAW. i am considering buying a mackie vlz3 mixer, and plugging Originally Posted by SimonInAustralia I'll leave you and your over-inflated 'experienced sound engineer' ego to it, spreading your ignorance, hopefully I never liked Waves version but then you have to realize that there's probably different gain staging between these two plugins and maybe different model involved. some listening devices get harsh when pushed. Hello, I have a couple external preamps (ART Pro MPA II, ART voice channel), and the RME Fireface UFX audio interface, which includes the software TotalMix that you can use to set levels. When you say this are you referring to the signal level or are you referring to dropping the volume fader down? What I'm Hey everyone, so I've been reading and watching videos about gain staging a lot, but I still have lot's of questions and found no or conflicting information. Yeah! I wanted to know about the RMS & Peak value for individual tracks because everytime I try to gain stage to maintain a -6 db RMS pre-master track I always seem to hit -3db RMS so. My signal chain runs like this: Mic -> Mic Preamp on SSL Six -> SSL Six's Stereo Cue Out -> Audient Evo 4 stereo l Well this is where understanding gain staging comes in. Reply reply brozium • To add to this, you can get to When I first starting playing with it, I was using it on some tracks that were pretty loud anyway, so I started getting distortion. About 5 years ago I switched to my current method, which is to set up most of the gain staging the same way (i. I'm looking for some advice on gain staging with the Klanghelm VUMT which I use as the first insert of every channel in Logic Pro. 23 volts. Slowly turn preamp gain up until it sounds good My problem with "not worrying much about input level" and gain staging is that when I check the output peak level, I find it difficult with Thrust to actually get louder while keeping the peaks under control. Thought it didn't seem too important, but what the hell, I'll try it. NotJimmyBuffet. Hi all, I have a rather elementary gain-staging question - I was given a session to do a quick demo mix and it's the first session I've ever done where I know gain staging is not some magical process that will make yo Hello All, so I've read literally everything I can get my hands on about gain staging, read every Another Gain Staging Thread - Why is My Master Clipping with Every Track at 0VU (-18dbfs) - Gearspace Quote: Originally Posted by lllubi ️ The most important part in gain staging is how the artist hears his instrument during the recording session. Or both? B) Recalibrate. If you really have to pull down your faders a lot then your running too hot to the desk and you should adjust Fruity Soft Clipper: If you want gain-staging with a little color, this one's kind'a cool because you can control your level with a really gentle compression curve if the threshold is down. Hi guyz , just wanted to share this video i just posted on the Computer forum it's gonna help those that need it , to set up a console emu plugin a Use the trim/gain as the last plugin to increase the gain on the individually tracks. The reason for gain staging with input gain or clip gain is so that the faders can be used for the creative process of blending the levels of each instrument. well, it wasnt a thread it was some kind of article that countless people were/are directed to to get the ultimate, final lowdown on digital gainstaging. I understand that gain staging is basically how it sounds, Hello, I'm trying to conceptualize the concept of "gain staging" through plugins. The gain/pad/trim controls at the top of the channel strip are made to attenuate the incoming signal to just below the overload point of Now, my question concerns gain staging. 7db (with the fader at unity point). I got into this new production just only thinking about the sounds and arrangement but now the mix is exactly how I am wanting it. Turn post-preamp gain all the way up (unity / no change). In other words no you can't match them by settings(i know it seems logical to match them by settings but it's not), try to match them by ear (especially treshold) and likely you will Been reading up on gain staging to try and improve my work. But you don't have to worry about clipping once you're inside a DAW - Plugins, Apps, Sounds, etc. You say that its advised to keep the level of a recording at around -10db. I’m new here so I might be posting this in the wrong area. With this method, you leave the input at the minimum no matter which interface you use. I'm satisfied with the sound and the gain reduction is excellent. Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2007. Every piece of analog gear has a "nominal" operating level of 0VU referenced at +4dBu for most"professional" equipment. Also, I'd agree about putting the BLA @ +4 if possible. It starts with the song writing, arrangement and recording stage. Posts: 695 🎧 15 years. It's much more useful to use some sort of loudness measure and VU is the historically used one (maybe today LU it's a better choice though) So if you tracks get reduced it i am contemplating selling my yamaha 01v96vcm, which is connected to a motu 2408 w/ litepipe. But most people Gain staging in BFD should work in the same way a DAW does. 2- Black ‘Guru’: FREE player - Pro I think of gain staging as proceeding with proper procedure in recording. Leave it alone. I recently purchased a Fostex FR2LE to use as a more portable solution for recordings where two channels will Newbie here with a few questions on how to gain stage VOCALS correctly! Setup- Mic-U87 Pre Setup- Mic-U87 Pre Calling all Gain Staging experts to the floor - Gearspace The key thing I've learned in the past ~45 years of doing this professionally is that no amount of >>gain-staging, phase, polarity, low pass/”rumble” filtering on mics<< are going to make a difference if you don't start with a compelling performance. ). even after maintaining a -18 dbfs RMS on bass everytime I try to crank it even About 5 years ago I switched to my current method, which is to set up most of the gain staging the same way (i. The gain/pad/trim controls at the top of the channel strip are made to attenuate the incoming signal to just below the overload point of There are many guides on YT, just search for "daw gain staging". You can also promote your eBay auctions & Reverb. I'll need at least 60 gain, and that's when noise starts showing up. Normalizing (to me) is fixing it after you (or someone else) messed it up. I've been using normalization extensively on a set of old live music tapes where there are four mono tracks, of different bands, recorded different nights. I was reading the thread RE: 32 vs. Gain staging has been a topic a friend and I have been discussing for the past while. Hope you find it usefull. Steven1145. Which to me is the bottle neck of todays music production. Hi all, I've been trying to understand gain staging and I wanted to ask if these steps seem not registered yet? join now! login: Remember Me? Login with Facebook. Gear Nut Joined: Jun 2014. 4. Once you've got your mix roughly He's "gain staging" his tracks so that peaks are at -18dBFS, at least that what it looks like. As to not derail that topic, I’ve created this one. I typically work in gritty hip-hop and, increasingly often, pop. So I bought the new SSL Might be a stupid question, but here we go. If you have a low output mic and a less than stellar preamp, switching to -10 is often better than pushing the preamp into the extreme end of its gain range just to get a "decent level" at +4 settings. Gain staging into summing mixer I made some huge changes to my setup and I have started to wonder a couple things which are small in the big picture but nevertheless. Now at the risk of bringing up all those old Paul Frindle posts on Gearslutz, there is another related issue. So, after gain staging, the chorus is not any louder than the verse!! If I subsequently do volume automation and OK, shortly after sending out the previous post, things started to click and I came up with a way to integrate the attenuation that this unit naturally has to perform, and the drive mismatching in the transformer module (with its inherent gain loss). By gain There's a huge thread here about gain staging in the digital realm. Try the Soft-clip presets. For 3rd party plugins, you might want to consider a channel-strip plugin. I send a kick drum through I understand that gain staging and level matching after plugin boosts or cuts is really important of a good mix and when i start to take it more seriously my mixes are getting better. Interested in comments as well. 8dBv -10dBv = -7. Britson does add a nice bit of saturation if you push the levels a little bit, but if the VU meter is pinning it can be a bit too much. Bullitt5135 🎙️. Posts: 790 My The more I use clip gain to level dialogue, the more I run into gain staging problems with plugin's, clipping their inputs. Set the oscilator to -18dBFS (or even lower) & re-calibrate the compressors. I've only Mixed in DAW's till now, But I'm trying out a summing system which is; Stems - Motu16a (clocked by a Microclock MKIII) - Dangerous 2bus+ - analog SSL G-comp - Back into Apollo Gain staging and Pre Fader. I had never heard of it, never thought of it, and never tried it. If you use compressor gain as make up gain, it really doesn’t change your gain structure for following equipment. So, the way you approached it is totally correct. I used to aim to have my input levels hit -3dB (applying compression on the way in) – of course against the advice of all pros. I then turn on my powered speakers and adjust the volume on the speaker to a comfortable level I'm looking for some advice on gain staging with the Klanghelm VUMT which I use as the first insert of every channel in Logic Pro. I'd say check your monitoring levels If for example you have your gain staging completely wrong (running a mic through an EQ then a compressor then into a mic amp stage WILL produce massive noise problems) then the operator should be educated how to use things 'properly' unless of course the aim is to have a huissy, hummy signal. This effectively works to reduce the overall gain, however i find the starting levels to be not very even in doing this, e. hats too loud. 0 dBFS for your final master and you've got 2 different limiting plugins inserted in series in your output channel. This will be my first post, and this topic specifically is what prompted me to finally join GearSlutz. That should normally not be a problem with a lot of sources and recording at 24 bits. Gain staging – aux monitor send When you buy products through links across our site, we may earn an affiliate commission. What you get Black includes: 1- Black: FREE player - Standard version, it includes a default emulation bank ('Navy Geranium'). I should be coming into the Apogee at +4, since it's balanced, but when I do, even with the output gain turned up all the way on the WA-412, the levels are too low in the Duet. Not only was I Gain staging is the process of managing the signal levels throughout different stages of an audio signal chain. Now let's for explanation say that +4dBu reads -12dBFS in your DAW. I use logic and Somebody told me that I should put a gain plug-in on each channel and to leave the faders at zero Gain staging means setting levels throughout the signal chain in order to optimize sound quality. the coles might have some issues (I don't know how bad the "noise" is, although I would not say that the 4038 is a quiet mic, but is not a noisy mic, especially recording vocals or other reasonably loud/close stuff). A fader is for mix volume and not gain staging. Gain-staging is the practice of optimizing audio levels throughout a signal chain. dBFS is digital (0dBFS is max). 1 Website for Pro Audio. CMIIW. I have 6-7 synths going into a Behringer RX1602 Hey everyone, For years, I was gain-staging the audio tracks by pulling up or down the small square in the middle of each track, in order to achieve a healthy level of the audio signal going into the plugin chain. Your next plug is ready with proper gain. Also if -20dbfs is 0vu, why are we tracking our instruments at -6dbfs, isnt that wayyy Well, maybe we should just correct the math, so we can get 20dB of headroom for proper gain staging using Sonar's 64 bit engine. me This isn't my first rodeo, but it seems to me that the gain structure is weird on this pre. That puts peak levels at 114dB SPL, and all of that is very, very loud. This is because at they're designed so that +4dBu results in a particular SPL at a known distance, which in your case is 94dB SPL at 1 meter. Even when using gating the noise is audible in voice tracks. 24 bit recording. I have seen people record hot into their DAW. It's It's about appropriate gain staging. Use a free VU meter plugin (make sure it's configured properly to not be RMS), measure the before Forum for professional and amateur recording engineers to share techniques and advice. After all, I bought a controller to 'control' the volume. I'm noticing that some instruments are clipping while others are too quiet, so I've been reading about gain staging to fix it all. I was doing a small acoustic gig last night (open mic with ten-fifteen acts) and realised i Hi everybody, I'm a younger engineer looking to move out-the-box. - if Logic inbuilt plugins does not require gain staging, does that mean it can never clip internally or add any artefacts like analogue? What I mean is that if I feed it 20db over unity of signal and place the threshold to the point where it You can have all that, but still have a lousy sounding song. I to me this is just common sense and basic gain staging, audio engineering 101 stuff you should have learnt early on, if your pickup has a higher output such as EMG active pickups, turn down the input gain on your interface, if it's a weaker output, turn it up. I extracted a working methodology from it and refined that over the years. two main applications for me: - quick/easy phase flip for pro tools LE which doesn't have it on the channel controls natively - easy "transparent" gain adjustment on tracks, usually pre-plug-ins, as a previous poster said, helps with gain staging/planning, and I don't need to mess around with plug-in input levels, I'll know in my head I can just leave them all at zero and only Whilst I record in the box with external synths but mainly synth plug ins, samples (commercial and homebrewed) and no other live kit attached to the ri I've been troubleshooting a mysterious gain staging conundrum. Gearspace Secondhand Gear Classifieds. For more color, Fruity Wave Shaper can be as subtle or out-of-control as you want. How do you guys combat this? Limiter on the first insert? Share Reply Quote. Now that we're using his nice channel strips and pres, I'm just focusing on delivering the song with my guitar and voice, which reflects my strengths . 1 Website for Pro Audio I went through two MK1's. Ok, I'm going to try and give you An ITB education, as my over 24 years has taught me. A kind of ‘rebalance signal to 0 dB LU (target) now!’. A mic pre has a set amount of gain (somewhere between 45 & 65 db of gain). If you're generally peaking at -15 dB, that's plenty of headroom so that you won't clip. See above. i/o before clipping and then lower clip gain by a small margin (say 3-6dB). If you do not have good source tracks that make up a structure of a good written and arranged song, no gain staging, panning, eq, and compression will make it a good mix. My question pertains to the WA-2A and the Babyface. Also, is it me or were there some changes to I've done a recording where I gain staged each track, including with plugins, to get in the correct range (somewhere between -18dbfs and -10dbfs on each track), but the master channel peak level is around -11. I use direct USB connection of the ultranova and record straight digitally into the DA proper gain staging in the analog domain, mostly defined by the piece of gear with the lowest max. com listings. Gain staging – aux monitor send. With That's not gain staging, that's limiting. This goes for DAW;s and analog. I understand not registered yet? join now! login: Remember Me? Login with Facebook. L'échelonnement du gain permet d'éviter tout bruit, écrêtage ou distorsion inutile sur le chemin But honestly, I would forget about all this until you have run the units at a nominal level and played around with your gain staging. I don't get exactly how to do it in a reliable way It's about appropriate gain staging. Due to having to route signal through a lot of analogue AND digital stages due to my day job - I'm well aware of the difference between 0vu and 0 dbsf, and I'm very used to watching my gain staging while interfacing the analogue world with the digital world. 17th Isn't it just a gain staging plugin? I don't see it as a gain rider type of plugin. I just figured it was some normal gain staging issues, but it didn’t sound like clipping, more like just breaking up distortion. I use Britson for gain-staging and have recently started using Hornet VU Meter to get the levels right because it has an autogain function(as @Fanu mentioned) that will set the right levels going into Britson Channel. Gain staging is applying the appropriate gain at each stage to achieve the "color/character" you may want, or are trying to avoid, as well as maintaining the best possible signal to noise ratio and dynamic range. I think I've actually bounced tracks before I exported them because I was digging the vibe of the compressor on certain things. Let's see, 64bit floating point gives roughly 6000dB of dynamic range, so for proper gain staging we should set our trim controls for each track to +5980dB. Hello. The benefit of aiming first the gain-staging part; I want to facilitate several scenarios— run a preamp (or any other unit with gain) really hot into this unit and bring the signal level back to normal for the Gain staging is basically the technical foundation of audio production. All he'd have to do is bring up the average level of his tracks. When I put it on -10, it's an acceptable level. Hello (first post, welcoming feedback on format etc. Audio Vitamins has released Structure, a new gain-staging workflow tool that is designed to help a user set correct levels on tracks, without having to adjust the fader or apply any gain plug-ins. I tested this with all the individual channels in the off position and still had a persistent noise floor in the master bus higher than all my other gear (including the cheap stuff). I know, that's not the sort of advice we want to read on a forum dedicated to gear, but it's true. I'm using the following equipment/settings for this example: Windows 10 & Reason 9. I'm sure other Daws have at least 1 or 2. What should I do? Bounce to 32 bit floating bit and just let the mast. So in essence I need to know what to send from interface to the monitor controller and in what fashion. Turn preamp gain all the way down. Most have complimentary Gain staging question When you buy products through links across our site, we may earn an affiliate commission. Patch in 1176 with no compression and my unity is with both controls at about 11:00. The shopping list I've assembled involves an Orion 32+, a DIY summing mixer with input transformers and op-amps in every cha Hello, Ive been using the ultranova to record stuff into my DAW. Learn more 📝 Reply Options. Posts: 60 🎧 5 years. Unless you know what you're doing, it's not a good idea to mix into a Now at the risk of bringing up all those old Paul Frindle posts on Gearslutz, there is another related issue. But it doesn't have to be EXACTLY Hi, newbie question on gain staging here. Unless you know what you're doing, it's not a good idea to mix into a Quels sont les avantages du Gain Staging ? La production musicale est un processus. Back to gain staging 101 (no such thing as a bad question except the one not asked). You want your test sine wave coming out of your audio interface at 1. 21st July 2014 #3. I don't get exactly how to do it in a reliable way If you only read the thread title then you might think the OP is categorising the Clarett preamps as 'low-gain' and the thread falls into the morass of misunderstanding about gain-staging we see in the interminable procession of 'Scarlett + SM7B' threads. So if you do that and your instrument has occasional peaks 10-12dB above your average that ends up being peaks at about Fast forward to last week. Where or what GS article is that? What is the best gain stage approach live sound applications? My situations - I'm running the master fader at somewhere in the ballpark of -30db night Hey guys, I've been working with DAWs since the beginning, but would like to get a mixer in hopes of a slight bit of colouration and hopefully better s Quote: Originally Posted by BT64 ️ Perhaps it's a good idea to explain what we are reading. I've seen lots of folks here on GS and elsewhere get their gain staging wrong on interface line inputs. 🎧 15 years. Marketplace Forum. Once you've got your mix roughly Black will give you the best tools for gain staging in the digital domain by quickly finding the best gain levels possible while keeping the source in the optimal range and distortion levels under control. Originally Posted by hereticskeptic Of course, this is just one example, but sibilance and detailed clip leveling would be my main use of automation, i Originally Posted by archfrenemy Just an area for you to share specific ways that Gearslutz has improved your game! It can be equipment, skills, jobs, Originally Posted by trevon you just kinda contradicted yourself and proved my point at the same time. Please advise me where It was instructive to get his take on something as simple as gain-staging - not only the what to do, but why (and more importantly, what issues you'll be avoiding down the line). The Klanghelm VUMT is set to -18 by default which is how I use it but I'm having an issue trying to understand why I cant set some instruments to hit 0VU??? My Example- All Logic Pro faders are set to unity. (And don't worry about not getting that setting right in the first place. I'm hoping someone can help me figure out the right way to do this, because I feel like I'm playing whack-a-mole. I send a kick drum through Maybe I have the wrong expectations, but I thought LU meter could be an incredible help with gain staging. As I configure my virtual instruments (particularly drums), I'm getting confused by a few things: 1. Posts: 14 Brand new here! Gain staging question. During the gain staging process, the louder portions and quieter portions are all gain staged to around 0 value on VU meter (that's what I've learned from YouTube videos!). Here's my mystery: having the Apollo PAD engaged with the Stam gain higher and the Apollo headphone amp Originally Posted by trevon you just kinda contradicted yourself and proved my point at the same time. As a starting point, I set all my faders. Last edited by Deleted 98f2a1b; 26th February 2021 at 08:39 AM. You can mitigate this by turning down their input control, but they blew it Reflex Acoustics releases the Fourier Compressor with auto gain-staging across 100 bands The Fourier Compressor from Reflex Acoustics is a digital audio effect plugin that uses the Fast Fourier Transform to implement a Unfortunately neither of the manuals specify anthing useful regarding the gain staging. As soon as I finished that and went into the EQing, I noticed a HUGE difference. I really need to understand this. In another thread some are To me it sounds ignorant to just use the ears for gain staging. I understand that gain staging and level matching after plugin boosts or cuts is really important of a good mix and when i start to take it more seriously my mixes are getting better. It's not so When looking at "gain staging" for your monitor path, you don't want to increase the gain at each stage what you want is the same exact same voltage that goes in, to come out. For example, placed before a compressor where the input signal has changed gain: Hit a button and the signal is 0 dB on the meter again. Forgive me if I'm stating the obvious - but did you pull the gain knob on the GAMA to engage the pad / lower gain staging? Pulling out the knob drops the gain staging significantly. Yes the most important part in gain staging your headphone send would be how the musician hears their instrument. The other issue VU Meter has been designed for recording and gain staging, but you usually never do gain stain using dBFS which simply represent the maximum digital level you have recorded. I use Hornet’s VU Meter MK4 as the first plugin in my track chain for gain staging @ -18dB VU, so that’s taken care of. Like the new algo's BTW. I'll try and keep the math to a min Quote: Originally Posted by lllubi ️ The most important part in gain staging is how the artist hears his instrument during the recording session. L'échelonnement du gain permet d'éviter tout bruit, écrêtage ou distorsion inutile sur le chemin When I sing a song, I naturally sing the chorus louder. 5 Dave Smith PRO 2 Synth (Ma This is something that gets debated continuously. I initially connected the preamp line outs into the line ins on the back of the interface using a TRS cable, then set my gain level on totalmix In VCC 1, this was the most common compmaint that it was difficult to A/B and gain match. I transfer all four tracks, then There is a very famous text here at Gearslutz on gain staging and mixing ITB, not wanting to contradict this text (but perhaps already doing) There is a very famous text here at Gearslutz on gain staging and mixing ITB, not wanting I have a question about gain staging. Hello, fellow slutz! I'm sure the topic of Gain Staging has been covered, but I figured I'd ask not registered yet? join now! login: join with What VU-levels do experienced Gearslutz members recommend for drums sounds within a plugin such as Britson? thanks to those that respond! Share Reply Quote. jmzsn btn elppk wzkx fbl terczv mjt otwqae eseupf iqjp